Condos for sail
2007-01-12 05:28 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
archershipshttp://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/07/04/CONDOS.TMP
Condos for sail
If you love the sea, these homes might float your boat
- David Armstrong, Chronicle Staff Writer
Tuesday, July 4, 2006
Click to ViewClick to View
Condos for sale on cruise ships. Great views. Changing seaside sites all around the world. From $500,000 to $8 million. Motivated sellers. May be coming to Bay Area soon.
It may be a stretch to call it a real estate tsunami -- a gently rising tide, maybe -- but putting plush condominiums on seaworthy cruise ships is drawing interest from developers, investors, entrepreneurs and gilt-edged hotel companies eager to plumb a new market.
Pitched by their champions as exotic and novel alternatives to traditional condos for landlubbers, privately owned waterborne condos exist on just one major ship -- the World, operated by a management company in Miami called ResidenSea Ltd. -- but at least three other companies are lining up to launch shipboard condos.
Condominium ships are "a very small piece of the market,'' according to Michael Paladino, a Fitch Ratings analyst who follows the cruise ship industry. "Certainly the large cruise operators haven't expressed interest in this market.''
However, an enterprising company that "wants to have a differentiated product out there'' could find the condominium ship market appealing, he said.
Condo ships are an unusual hybrid of travel and real estate, a hybrid so new that there is a dearth of experts who oversee the field, and operating rules that are still fluid. Four years ago, when condo buyers on the World felt disgruntled about the ship's ports-of-call itinerary, they formed an owners association and bought the ship. The vessel is now a co-op.
Although much remains unknown about this market niche, a cluster of companies have declared interest in getting their feet wet.
Toronto's Four Seasons Hotels and Resorts, the high-end hotelier, has licensed a Miami partner, Four Seasons Ocean Club Ltd., to launch a vessel in the fall of next year under the Four Seasons brand.
Condo Cruise Lines International, also anchored in Florida, says it will float its first condo-carrying ship in February. Condo Cruise Lines plans to homeport one or two ships at the Port of San Francisco if a deal can be worked out.
Around the world
That would bring an unspecified amount of new spending to the city. The ships are to be provisioned here, and between 400 and 500 condo owners and passengers would arrive in town and prepare to embark on what Condo Cruise Lines President and CEO Mark Boyd said will be around-the-world cruises sailing from the Golden Gate.
It's an intriguing possibility, but far from a done deal, the company and the port agree.
Peter Dailey, deputy director of maritime operations at the port, says Condo Cruise Lines, based in the northwestern Florida city of Destin, has yet to contact San Francisco officials, who would need to oversee the permit process.
"I don't know much about it, except what I've seen on the Web and read in the trades,'' Dailey said. "Cruise ships are a sector we are trying to promote. Having a cruise ship on the water is a beautiful sight. It plays to the city's strength, which is tourism. We're amenable to talk to them.''
Boyd, who founded privately held Condo Cruise Lines with investors, acknowledged that the San Francisco home-porting plan -- hailed on the company's Web site and in a press release by Condo Cruise Lines -- is not battened down.
"We'd like to homeport our first ship -- which is 80 percent sold out -- in San Francisco,'' Boyd said by telephone from Florida. "I don't think it will be a big moneymaker for the city of San Francisco. The ship would be in port about one week a year, then sail on a two-year, round-the-world cruise. We'll move the ship from its Singapore dry dock to San Francisco, then start cruising, beginning with West Coast and other Pacific ports.''
Boyd said his company's first ship -- presently a floating casino in Hong Kong -- will be converted into a condo carrier this fall in Singapore. Plans call for staterooms to be enlarged and remade into suites. Boyd said suites on the 560-foot-long ship are listed from $500,000 to $1.2 million for one-room units to three-room penthouse suites.
In addition, there's a $20,000 monthly fee for a package that includes all shipboard meals, television hook-ups, a health club, housekeeping services and Internet access, Boyd said.
Many shipboard units have been sold to Californians, he said.
"They're buying property in Arizona and Las Vegas, where prices are more sane. We have what those people are looking for: No property taxes, you don't have to buy furniture, don't have to set up cable TV, every meal is free.''
Some will be rentals
According to Boyd, "We get a range of buyers, from the guy who says, 'When I retire, I'm going to sail around the world,' to another guy who says, 'I'll never set foot on it. I can rent it for four times my mortgage, rather than two times my mortgage, as it is on land.' For condo owners who want to rent out their units, the company says it will charge a 30 percent rental management fee.
Mixing condo owners who want to live full-time or nearly full-time aboard ship with vacationers who rent for short periods could create an uncomfortable mix, said Fitch Ratings' Michael Paladino. "There could be a difference in how people take care of the units, and you could get different types of people,'' he observed.
Boyd, who described himself as a consultant to Florida real estate interests, looked out to sea when available beachfront land became harder to find and fears of hurricanes dampened the condominium market on terra firma.
While Condo Cruise Lines is an unknown quantity, established companies drawn by what they think could become a lucrative niche are getting into the floating condo market, too.
First into the water, in 2002, was Miami's ResidenSea. The company's 644-foot ship, the World, offers condos for sale and rooms for rent. ResidenSea takes pains to make clear that its customer experience differs from those of popular cruise ship lines -- some geared to budget travelers -- beloved by vacationers in search of groaning-board buffets and carousing nightlife.
A long journey
"Ours is a quieter pace, more adventurous in our travels but more relaxed in lifestyle, in many ways quite similar to luxury yacht ownership,'' according to the ResidenSea Web site. "Our time is ours to do with as we please, choosing to enjoy the life ashore -- opera, museums, restaurants, shops; to see natural wonders -- fjords, mountains, icebergs, deserts, coral reefs and beaches. We also enjoy playing golf on the world's great courses. ... We always have the whole world to explore and enjoy -- without ever moving from our own home.''
According to the company, the World's itinerary this summer includes stops in Ho Chi Minh City (Saigon), as well as Brunei, Kota Kinabalu in Malaysian Borneo, the Thailand resort of Phuket and Australia's Great Barrier Reef. This winter, the ship is scheduled to call in French Polynesia and Chile -- the better to bask in the Southern Hemisphere's summer.
The World, which has about 200 residents spread out over 12 decks, is staffed by a crew of 250 assigned to pamper condo owners and their pals. The units, which ResidenSea says are 95 percent sold, list for $825,000 to $6.3 million, not including a maintenance fee, which is calculated by square footage.
Four Seasons, which operates dozens of five-star hotels in Europe, Asia and North America -- including hotels in East Palo Alto and San Francisco, where it also hosts residential units -- plans to take to the waves with its condo ship in the fall of 2007.
The 12-deck, 656-foot ship will offer 96 residences, according to Four Seasons Ocean Club, and will be built expressly to carry condos. According to the club, the ship will entice condo buyers with a swimming pool and cabanas, a spa and wellness center, a golf simulator, driving range and putting greens, plus high-speed Internet access, personal chefs and personal trainers, and high-end shipboard shops and restaurants.
All this does not, of course, come cheap. Units on board the good ship Four Seasons are being offered from $416,000 to $4.2 million, according to the company.
With prices set lower than Four Seasons and ResidenSea, Condo Cruise Lines hopes its offering will appeal to people who -- while affluent -- don't have to be super-rich.
Boyd, the Condo Cruise Lines executive, said his company will be represented at a Real Estate Wealth show scheduled for Moscone Center in late August, where it will have a booth next to yet another condo ship firm: Residential Cruise Line Ltd., based in Arizona, which says it plans to launch its residential ship -- called the Magellan -- in 2009.
In a slick, large-format sales book, the Magellan's units are listed from $1.8 million to $8 million. The ship is expected to be an 860-foot, 15-deck vessel, staffed by 300 employees. Annual fees, in addition to purchase prices, start at $96,000 and go as high as $228,000, according to Residential Cruise Line sales materials.
For people who can't spend that much but still want a home sweet home on the waves, Condo Cruise Lines' $500,000 to $1.2 million sales prices might be just right, Boyd said.
Given that his company's first ship is reportedly 80 percent sold, Boyd said he plans to push ahead and amass a fleet of five ships -- all converted from use as conventional cruise ships at an average cost of $12 million. Condo Cruise Lines expects to spend from $11 million to $80 million each to buy the additional ships, and is still negotiating with their present owners, Boyd said.
"This is a parallel real estate market,'' he said.
Page E - 1
URL: http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/07/04/CONDOS.TMP
Condos for sail
If you love the sea, these homes might float your boat
- David Armstrong, Chronicle Staff Writer
Tuesday, July 4, 2006
Click to ViewClick to View
Condos for sale on cruise ships. Great views. Changing seaside sites all around the world. From $500,000 to $8 million. Motivated sellers. May be coming to Bay Area soon.
It may be a stretch to call it a real estate tsunami -- a gently rising tide, maybe -- but putting plush condominiums on seaworthy cruise ships is drawing interest from developers, investors, entrepreneurs and gilt-edged hotel companies eager to plumb a new market.
Pitched by their champions as exotic and novel alternatives to traditional condos for landlubbers, privately owned waterborne condos exist on just one major ship -- the World, operated by a management company in Miami called ResidenSea Ltd. -- but at least three other companies are lining up to launch shipboard condos.
Condominium ships are "a very small piece of the market,'' according to Michael Paladino, a Fitch Ratings analyst who follows the cruise ship industry. "Certainly the large cruise operators haven't expressed interest in this market.''
However, an enterprising company that "wants to have a differentiated product out there'' could find the condominium ship market appealing, he said.
Condo ships are an unusual hybrid of travel and real estate, a hybrid so new that there is a dearth of experts who oversee the field, and operating rules that are still fluid. Four years ago, when condo buyers on the World felt disgruntled about the ship's ports-of-call itinerary, they formed an owners association and bought the ship. The vessel is now a co-op.
Although much remains unknown about this market niche, a cluster of companies have declared interest in getting their feet wet.
Toronto's Four Seasons Hotels and Resorts, the high-end hotelier, has licensed a Miami partner, Four Seasons Ocean Club Ltd., to launch a vessel in the fall of next year under the Four Seasons brand.
Condo Cruise Lines International, also anchored in Florida, says it will float its first condo-carrying ship in February. Condo Cruise Lines plans to homeport one or two ships at the Port of San Francisco if a deal can be worked out.
Around the world
That would bring an unspecified amount of new spending to the city. The ships are to be provisioned here, and between 400 and 500 condo owners and passengers would arrive in town and prepare to embark on what Condo Cruise Lines President and CEO Mark Boyd said will be around-the-world cruises sailing from the Golden Gate.
It's an intriguing possibility, but far from a done deal, the company and the port agree.
Peter Dailey, deputy director of maritime operations at the port, says Condo Cruise Lines, based in the northwestern Florida city of Destin, has yet to contact San Francisco officials, who would need to oversee the permit process.
"I don't know much about it, except what I've seen on the Web and read in the trades,'' Dailey said. "Cruise ships are a sector we are trying to promote. Having a cruise ship on the water is a beautiful sight. It plays to the city's strength, which is tourism. We're amenable to talk to them.''
Boyd, who founded privately held Condo Cruise Lines with investors, acknowledged that the San Francisco home-porting plan -- hailed on the company's Web site and in a press release by Condo Cruise Lines -- is not battened down.
"We'd like to homeport our first ship -- which is 80 percent sold out -- in San Francisco,'' Boyd said by telephone from Florida. "I don't think it will be a big moneymaker for the city of San Francisco. The ship would be in port about one week a year, then sail on a two-year, round-the-world cruise. We'll move the ship from its Singapore dry dock to San Francisco, then start cruising, beginning with West Coast and other Pacific ports.''
Boyd said his company's first ship -- presently a floating casino in Hong Kong -- will be converted into a condo carrier this fall in Singapore. Plans call for staterooms to be enlarged and remade into suites. Boyd said suites on the 560-foot-long ship are listed from $500,000 to $1.2 million for one-room units to three-room penthouse suites.
In addition, there's a $20,000 monthly fee for a package that includes all shipboard meals, television hook-ups, a health club, housekeeping services and Internet access, Boyd said.
Many shipboard units have been sold to Californians, he said.
"They're buying property in Arizona and Las Vegas, where prices are more sane. We have what those people are looking for: No property taxes, you don't have to buy furniture, don't have to set up cable TV, every meal is free.''
Some will be rentals
According to Boyd, "We get a range of buyers, from the guy who says, 'When I retire, I'm going to sail around the world,' to another guy who says, 'I'll never set foot on it. I can rent it for four times my mortgage, rather than two times my mortgage, as it is on land.' For condo owners who want to rent out their units, the company says it will charge a 30 percent rental management fee.
Mixing condo owners who want to live full-time or nearly full-time aboard ship with vacationers who rent for short periods could create an uncomfortable mix, said Fitch Ratings' Michael Paladino. "There could be a difference in how people take care of the units, and you could get different types of people,'' he observed.
Boyd, who described himself as a consultant to Florida real estate interests, looked out to sea when available beachfront land became harder to find and fears of hurricanes dampened the condominium market on terra firma.
While Condo Cruise Lines is an unknown quantity, established companies drawn by what they think could become a lucrative niche are getting into the floating condo market, too.
First into the water, in 2002, was Miami's ResidenSea. The company's 644-foot ship, the World, offers condos for sale and rooms for rent. ResidenSea takes pains to make clear that its customer experience differs from those of popular cruise ship lines -- some geared to budget travelers -- beloved by vacationers in search of groaning-board buffets and carousing nightlife.
A long journey
"Ours is a quieter pace, more adventurous in our travels but more relaxed in lifestyle, in many ways quite similar to luxury yacht ownership,'' according to the ResidenSea Web site. "Our time is ours to do with as we please, choosing to enjoy the life ashore -- opera, museums, restaurants, shops; to see natural wonders -- fjords, mountains, icebergs, deserts, coral reefs and beaches. We also enjoy playing golf on the world's great courses. ... We always have the whole world to explore and enjoy -- without ever moving from our own home.''
According to the company, the World's itinerary this summer includes stops in Ho Chi Minh City (Saigon), as well as Brunei, Kota Kinabalu in Malaysian Borneo, the Thailand resort of Phuket and Australia's Great Barrier Reef. This winter, the ship is scheduled to call in French Polynesia and Chile -- the better to bask in the Southern Hemisphere's summer.
The World, which has about 200 residents spread out over 12 decks, is staffed by a crew of 250 assigned to pamper condo owners and their pals. The units, which ResidenSea says are 95 percent sold, list for $825,000 to $6.3 million, not including a maintenance fee, which is calculated by square footage.
Four Seasons, which operates dozens of five-star hotels in Europe, Asia and North America -- including hotels in East Palo Alto and San Francisco, where it also hosts residential units -- plans to take to the waves with its condo ship in the fall of 2007.
The 12-deck, 656-foot ship will offer 96 residences, according to Four Seasons Ocean Club, and will be built expressly to carry condos. According to the club, the ship will entice condo buyers with a swimming pool and cabanas, a spa and wellness center, a golf simulator, driving range and putting greens, plus high-speed Internet access, personal chefs and personal trainers, and high-end shipboard shops and restaurants.
All this does not, of course, come cheap. Units on board the good ship Four Seasons are being offered from $416,000 to $4.2 million, according to the company.
With prices set lower than Four Seasons and ResidenSea, Condo Cruise Lines hopes its offering will appeal to people who -- while affluent -- don't have to be super-rich.
Boyd, the Condo Cruise Lines executive, said his company will be represented at a Real Estate Wealth show scheduled for Moscone Center in late August, where it will have a booth next to yet another condo ship firm: Residential Cruise Line Ltd., based in Arizona, which says it plans to launch its residential ship -- called the Magellan -- in 2009.
In a slick, large-format sales book, the Magellan's units are listed from $1.8 million to $8 million. The ship is expected to be an 860-foot, 15-deck vessel, staffed by 300 employees. Annual fees, in addition to purchase prices, start at $96,000 and go as high as $228,000, according to Residential Cruise Line sales materials.
For people who can't spend that much but still want a home sweet home on the waves, Condo Cruise Lines' $500,000 to $1.2 million sales prices might be just right, Boyd said.
Given that his company's first ship is reportedly 80 percent sold, Boyd said he plans to push ahead and amass a fleet of five ships -- all converted from use as conventional cruise ships at an average cost of $12 million. Condo Cruise Lines expects to spend from $11 million to $80 million each to buy the additional ships, and is still negotiating with their present owners, Boyd said.
"This is a parallel real estate market,'' he said.
Page E - 1
URL: http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/07/04/CONDOS.TMP